Join Ed and Bill as they discuss James Clear's book Atomic Habits. Ed and Bill discuss habits for Christian leaders and how the Bible addresses this topic.
Learn more at renewts.com
Join Ed and Bill as they discuss James Clear's book Atomic Habits. Ed and Bill discuss habits for Christian leaders and how the Bible addresses this topic.
Learn more at renewts.com
Does your faith break through? Are you one of the few? Oh, are you one of the few?
Bill:Well, we want to welcome you to episode 78 of the few, a podcast for faith empowered workplace leaders. My name is Bill.
Ed:And I'm Ed. And today we're going to be talking about habits and the faith empowered workplace leader. And actually we're going to be doing that by talking about a book that pretty much as popular as all get out in the organizational and business world today. Atomic habits by James clear. And then we're going to be trying to bring in, you know what the Bible has to say about habits. It's what we as people of faith what habits mean to us, good habits and bad habits, how to make good habits and break the bad habits is I think probably what we should be doing. Before we get started though, I want to say I'm coughing like crazy today, so I will try to edit as much as possible, but it may not be be as quite as, as awesome as it normally is. Bill. So come on, come on.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:can fix
Track 1:So yeah, we'll, we'll fix it as best as we can. So,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:All
Track 1:so before you got any other things on the introduction that we need to share.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:No, I, this one, the book, I guess the introduction of the of it would be for me, I just think it's real helpful. It's one of those books that is entirely secular. A lot of stuff, but I think it has tremendous application, not just in the business world, but also in the church. So yeah, it's good. It's a
Track 1:Right. Yeah, I, I think probably for me and, and we mentioned this a couple of podcasts ago when we kind of preface that we were going to be doing this this is one of those books where, you know, you read a lot of books and, and they kind of are just going over things that other books have brought out. And this is really. This is really good. Kind of maybe not new stuff maybe, but packaged in a way that, that it's, it's for me, it captivated me. It was easy to read it. It made a difference in my everyday life and practice. So excited to talk about it today.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Me too.
Track 1:Before we get into it though, let's get into a little bit of
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Front porch wisdom. So Ed, what do you have today in terms of front porch wisdom that we could share?
Track 1:I thought as we are looking or just coming out of the NCAA tournament basketball tournament, I thought maybe we would try to center our wisdom around. Basketball quotes from basketball coaches. And so the one I have today is from legendary coach Dean Smith, who spent most of his career at North Carolina. Dean Smith is credited with saying a lion never roars after the kill. And we talk about humility a lot on the podcast. And I think everybody out there that listens to us probably knows that humility is a great foundational principle in leadership and People who roar a lot, usually aren't great leaders. And I just thought that was a good, a good quote from from Dean Smith. A lion never wars after it's kill, take your win and go on to the next thing. So
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:like you've been there before, right?
Track 1:exactly.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:I'm going to go with John Wooden and you know, everybody, a couple of leadership books written that chronicle him and some on an interview basis, but, but one of the quotes that goes very well with our topic today that's credited to John Wooden is, is this, there are no big things, only a logical accumulation of little things done at a very high standard of performance. And when you think about successful coaches, they have great attention to detail. I remember one time I was when my son was still in high school playing football, I went out for a walk and just walking past the stadium where they were practicing. And I played football all the way through growing up and things. And they were doing a drill that I actually hadn't ever seen people do at the high school where he was playing. And what they were doing is they were, you know, one of the things that you often have to do in a football game, if things are going bad for you is you have to take an angle and run down a guy. Who's gotten outside of the Angle, if you take the right angle, you, he might be faster than you, but if you take the right angle, you can catch him. So they were teaching them how to run and take angles to, to catch people. And I don't ever remember having been taught that.
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:I mean, that was a fine detail and, and this particular team has been, you know, they've made the state playoffs every year for, for many. And in my mind, that's an example of paying attention to certain little details,
Track 1:Mm hmm.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:that, that accumulate over time. So
Track 1:Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And it does, it does fit perfectly in with what we're talking about today. Doesn't it? Because as we start talking and we'll just go ahead and move into it the book atomic habits, you know, the whole premise of the book that clear rights is atomic habits, aren't atomic in, in kind of the way you might think of an atom bomb being powerful and explosive, right? But atomic in, in the sense of an atom. Being kind of the, the small basic building block of other things. He just talks about the fact that, that paying attention, just exactly what wouldn't said paying attention to those little habits every day brings great results. And, and it really is the premise. And, and for me, my experience with a book and why it kind of resonated with me so much was it kind of smacked me in the face, to be honest with you. You know, so much of my life I've been so goal oriented, you know, and I've been taught that way and I've taught others that way. that, you know, you really need a vision. You need goals to be able to meet that vision and, you know, whether you want to call them, you know, object, key objectives, goals, wig goals, whatever you call them. And, and yet the point he makes is that you know, he basically says goals aren't bad goals are good, but goals aren't really what drive us to accomplish things. You know, it is the changes in the everyday habits. That we, that we have and that we develop that actually get us over the line when it comes to comes to that. So,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:One of the, the quote, one of my favorite quotes in the book happens early on where he says, you do not rise to the level of your goals. You fall to the level of your systems Or habits.
Track 1:right,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:and I think you can see that played out in the life of the church. And, and what we've begun working on here since the beginning of the year at the church where I, I pastor is, is trying to cultivate those, those, those It's like four specific habits that will help us, you know, fulfill the mission that God's given us here, this place. And
Track 1:right,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:instead of saying our goal is to, to create this ministry, build that building, do these things, we want to cultivate these four habits and
Track 1:right,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:that complicated.
Track 1:right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:yeah, it's a total
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:not, I don't think it's necessarily a totally different way of looking at things, but it's a very, to me it makes so much more sense. and, and it's very practical, very, anybody could, if you just listen to what he's saying and you can take little steps, you can make significant change and see significant improvement or change in, in your life or in your organization if you
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:to those finer details.
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. And, and I agree with you. I don't think it's necessarily like an overhaul or a throwing away of the model of kind of having a mission and a vision and goals that get you there, key objectives, and then a strategy for how you're going to do it. To me, it's more a change of focus. So you're not focused on the outcomes. You're not focused on the goals.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Mm
Track 1:of focusing on the daily things that help you reach those goals, you know, and so one of the stories in the books that he tells that I think is really, really makes a lot of sense is he draws a picture of a person sitting in a room that's temperature controlled with a glass of water in front of them. And, you know, you start off at a certain temperature and the temperature is lowered one degree at a time. And you're watching that glass of water and nothing happens. Nothing happens. Nothing happens until the temperature gets below freezing. And then the water starts to change. And as you've sat there for hours, you would think that the water changed, you know, instantly that, that nothing happened for an hour. And then all of a sudden the water instantly changed. The fact is for that last hour. The degrees have been moving down, you know, one degree at a time, one degree at a time, one degree at a time. And he relates that to our habits on how, you know, our good habits, you know, when we develop good habits, there are results that come, all of us can come up with all kinds of, you know, illustrations in the church world. You know, I think we call, you know, their basic spiritual disciplines are. spiritual habits, you know?
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Mm hmm.
Track 1:so if we are disciplined to pray daily we may not see a lot of change in our life, change in our own hearts, that kind of stuff overnight. But one day we wake up and we're like, wow, I'm a different person. And it doesn't necessarily happen overnight, but it is an accumulation of a prayer life, a habitual prayer life that you're doing on a regular basis over and over and over again. And so, so we see that, right? We see it in our health. You know, if you get up and you run a mile every morning. You may not see great change in the first week or the second week or the first month, but there will come a time when you'll be able to say, wow, I'm healthier, you know, and it's because of the daily habit of running and any talks about bad habits and it's the same thing, you know, like we can get away with bad habits for a while and participating in a bad habit for one day may not be that bad, you know, maybe, maybe again on the health side, but the cumulative effect of those habits over time. You know, have outcomes that are not what we're trying to accomplish. And so, so I really like, like the way he, he does this, but back to my, my point, I think when I started this was it's the focus, we still have goals, you know, but the focus is on, okay, this is my goal. But today for me to be able to reach that goal somewhere in the future today, I need to do this. And and then there's an inherent kind of reward, even in the daily habits, he says. So
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Right. As, as we kind of just walk through the book, kind of to give an introduction to it. You know, he opens with that whole how habits become of our lives, you know, that, that system, would you, how about describing what, what he describes that four step little process of, know, creating a habit or things becoming a habit in our lives.
Track 1:Yeah. Well, again, and like you said, Bill, you know, he's coming from a very secular kind of psychological sociological point of view. But he says basically that all habits start with a Q and this is a I'm going to take the summary from four minute books. com, which is a good place to kind of see the book summarized. But he says that a Q is a piece of information that suggests there's a reward to be found like the smell of a cookie or a dark room waiting to light up. Right. There's some sort of a Q that you're like, I would like to. have this or accomplish this or, or whatever it might be. And then the second thing then is that Q moves into a craving
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Yeah.
Track 1:and the craving then is there is motivation added to the Q you know there's, I want to change something. I want to do something. I want to make some moves to be able to get the reward, you know, to use the cookie illustration again, you know, I need to do something to be able to actually taste the cookie, right? Or to light up the room, I need to walk across and turn on the switch. And then there's a response and it's that he describes it as whatever thought or action you need to take to get the reward.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Yeah.
Track 1:And then there's the reward, the satisfying feeling you get from the change along, along the lesson, whether to do it again or not. So. So there is this cue, there is this craving, there is this response, and then there is this reward and, and, you know, I, I think that there's, there's validity in what he has to say there. How would you bill, how would you kinda as a person of faith and bringing the Holy spirit in all this, how would you. How would you you know, speak of this for those of us who are followers of Christ? More than just the, I want a cookie. I, I smell a cookie. I want a cookie. You know, I go get a cookie or do what I need to, to get a cookie. And then the cookie is good.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:I think what would be a little bit different for us is that we have the Holy Spirit at work in us. And the part of the role of the Holy Spirit is to, to move on our desires. And I do think that there's significant intersection between scripture and this whole idea of habits. I mean, yeah. You've got where in Romans 12, where he switches to the practical application of all the stuff that he's been speaking up to that point, he talks about, we're transformed by the renewing of our minds you know, changing the way we deal with those things. And then in Philippians, the apostle Paul talks about you know, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right,
Track 1:Mm.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:is pure, you know, think about these things you know, don't be anxious for nothing. So he's trying to challenge them to get away from the habit of being anxious about things and he's telling them
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:And so when, when I look at it from a biblical perspective, I think there are cues that we get that could be good. That could, could give us a craving to do something that would be good. There are cues that we get that could foster a craving for something bad, you know,
Track 1:Yeah. Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:and, and then we are left to respond, but the difference in, in, in the believer is that we don't respond in our own way. It's not just our own strength or our own wisdom that
Track 1:Mm. Right. Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:present within us and able to, to help us make the best choice and, and then to follow through and, and, and either be If it was one that we shouldn't have done to experience the conviction of the Holy Spirit,
Track 1:Mm hmm.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:that we should have, you know, the blessing of, of, of that obedience.
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:know, that's kind
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:I guess a way to look at it from, from the believer's perspective, but
Track 1:Mm hmm.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:it's a process as he talks about, you know, cue craving response and reward. I think that that's something we see in scripture, whether it's a temptation to do something we shouldn't, or God calling us to do something, know, noble. I
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:it's, it's there.
Track 1:Yeah, it's almost like you can see the spiritual warfare in this, isn't it?
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Yeah,
Track 1:mean, it's almost like on the bad side, the cue, you know, is a sinful idea that comes up. The craving is, you know, you want to act on that, you know, you start to desire it. And then the, the reward or the response is I commit the sin and the reward is the, you know, personal gratification that comes with sin that, you know, that feeds our, our sinful nature. And then on the other side, it is, like you said, it is a spirit giving us an inkling that here's something we should desire. And then as, as, as a spirit works more, we do desire to pray, you know, and then as we make the response and we pray more than we get the reward and the spirit's working through all of that. And the spirit's working on the negative by helping us not. Give in to those kind of bad habits, I think. But yeah, I agree with you. I think it's just kind of like the spirit is infused in all this for those of us who are people of faith. And so, so I think if we move on to that, then why, why this is so, I think very practical for me. Is we should be as Christians asking the question every day based on those things. We know God wants us to accomplish. What habits do I need to develop every day to make that happen? So I think I mentioned a couple of weeks ago on the podcast, one of the ways that it personally really impacted me was, as a Christian, I typically in the, at the beginning of the year, I'm a goal guy and I sketch out like goals for the year in different categories, you know, like I have spiritual goals and physical goals and kind of mental intellectual goals. And, and I may have specific goals around something, you know, like this year we have things we want to do at the house or their house goals that kind of stuff. And then I always back up from those goals. And I think, okay, what do I need to do to accomplish that? Well, each month I need to, I need to meet these goals, you know, so, so the yearly goal is my wig, you know, if you're familiar with that terminology or my, my big goal. And then the monthly goals are my key objectives that I need to accomplish to be able at the end of the year to say, I had made this goal And then there are these daily or weekly kind of goals that I would put in there that I need to, you know, do this by the second week of the month and this by the fourth week of the month so that I can accomplish this in the months I can accomplish this in a year. Well, after I read this book, I was like, well, I need to do is I need to develop different habits.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Yeah.
Track 1:if I'm going to accomplish this at the end of the year, what habits do I need to develop on a daily basis that will help me accomplish this? So I began, you know, I still am that guy. So. So I still made my chart, but rather than having goals, I put daily habits. Like I need to do this, you know, so on physical health, you know, obviously since we started going to YouTube, now everybody knows I need to lose weight when we were just podcasting. I could get away with that. But it's a battle that I fought for years and years and years, you know, so rather than I want to lose this much weight in a year, which means I need to lose this much weight per month, which means I need to lose this much weight. Per week. I still have a goal of how much weight I want to lose per year. I have a goal of how much weight I want to lose per month. But my daily and weekly is not goals or habits. You know, I need to do this every day. I need to do this every day. And, and while it sounds very elementary, you know, it is really, it really is pretty awesome when you start thinking about the difference where the focus comes back to the day and you do get, I think the same kind of fulfillment, right? Like, even if you don't hit your goal, you know, one of the things like, For people who are trying to do weight loss is you work and work and work and you want to lose five pounds. You only lose three. You feel like an utter failure. You know, it's like, man, what do I have to do? But if you're really focused on, I'm going to eat healthier, I'm going to exercise, I'm going to drink more water and you're able to develop those habits. There is a fulfillment in just, I did that, you know, that is, that's habit for me now. So, so
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:reading, you
Track 1:Yeah,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:when I look at my most vibrant or the seasons of my life when I was most engaged and just excited about what God was doing in my life. I was getting up later than 6 a. m. and I was either going straight to a devotional time or I was doing physical, I was exercising one of the two and, and, and that, you know, starting off, I would get to my office before anybody else was here. I could have quiet, could get my day organized. And I felt like I was being very productive and over time I got away from that. And you know when my wife was going through some some medical treatments, I was, I started staying home and, and waiting till she was making sure she was good for the day before I went in and kind of got out of that habit. And then in reading this book, I got. I was reminded of some of those things. And so the first little step I took is I started every night. I set my alarm for 6 a. m. again, instead of, you know, just waiting. And, and, and so regardless of whether I've got all the other things lined up yet, I've started that one, you
Track 1:right, right, right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:yeah.
Track 1:Yeah. And that's a great point because that's what he talks about. That's such a small thing, right? Setting your alarm, but that's a habit, you know, and that leads to you doing what you need to do. So, yeah. So before we go down through his laws, cause we do need to get there. There's a couple of things that I want to bring out that have been just kind of very impactful on me. The first thing is his conversation about identity. And, and basically what he says is habits come out of your identity. And so he talks a lot about identifying. So let me explain. Kind of the concept, right? So instead of being an unhealthy person that's trying to eat healthy, you want to try to identify as a person who eats healthy, you know, because if I, you know, if I go in and I'm like, I'm not a healthy eater, you know, but I'm gonna try to, to eat healthy, that's different than going in and convincing myself, you know what, I'm a healthy eater. This is what healthy eaters choose. This is what I'm going to choose. Now it sounds like kind of hocus pocus stuff, right? Like we're just trying to, but, but my point in this is how many times have we been told By scripture that we are somebody that we don't believe we are right. Our identity is in Christ. We are a new creation in Christ and yet we still act as if we're not right. And so this identity, I think is huge on these habits. Like, like if I'm trying to, if I'm trying to, to build my prayer life, right. There's a difference between me being someone I'm not a person that normally prays, you know, in my head. That's not me, but I'm saying in our heads, we can beat up or I'm a, I'm a, I belong to Christ followers of Christ. Pray. That's what we do, right? There's an identity that this is what I do. I'm part of this group and this is what this group does. So, so to me, I think that that was big for me. And then the other thing that I think was very practical that we'll get into here a little bit when we get into the laws. But the other thing that really hit me was habit stacking. And, and, and this was his way of just saying, if you want to develop good habits, there are some tricks to do. And basically habit stacking is if you have a habit that you do and it's not a struggle for you, like probably, or at least I hope and pray, Everyone who listens to us brushes their teeth, you know, every morning when they get up at some point, same time, every day you brush your teeth. Well, if you want to develop another habit, then do it before you brush your teeth every day or right after you brush your teeth. And it makes it easier to call it called habit stacking. And I've done that. It is phenomenal the way we're wired, how much easier it is to do something when you, you, you loop, you you know, wedded to something else that you're already doing. It's, it does work. It's pretty but so that was a little tip and trick that I picked up out of the book. That was very, very good for me. So yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:And I, and I agree. I, I've actually been trying to do some of the stacking. I make coffee every morning. And so now while the coffee is brewing, I make myself sit down and read scripture.
Track 1:Yep.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:You
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:that's
Track 1:Perfect example.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Yeah.
Track 1:Yeah. Perfect example. So, so let's get in into the, the, what he calls the laws, Bill, you want to start us off in a conversation on that?
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:the, know, that first law that he lifts up is really, It's pretty obvious, isn't it, Ed? If there's a habit that we want to establish in our lives, then the first law is to make it obvious.
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:you find ways to make it easy and obvious for you to, to be reminded of it. You need that cue.
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:to,
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:that habit. So this is
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:of setting up a cue. So you make that habit obvious.
Track 1:Do you have any examples of what that would look like?
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Well, like for me doing the coffee thing, I've got the coffee pot there. And on the counter near where the coffee pot is, I leave my, my duct taped Bible there as a reminder. So
Track 1:Hmm.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:there, it's readily accessible. And, and I, and I read it.
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:So that's probably an oversimplified example, but
Track 1:Mm hmm.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:you find ways to put it in front of you so that you have those positive cues,
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. And this really is an environmental thing. You know, he's talking about the environment in this section of the book in making it obvious. And, and one of the things, because we'll, we'll go into this in a minute, but, but this is how to develop good habits, right? And you, and you basically invert the system on, on breaking bad ones. You make it less obvious if you want to, you, you know, if you want to break a bad habit. So, So for me, one of the things that I've struggled with since COVID is working at home. I'm kind of, I kind of, it's necessary for me to work a home a lot. And I'm really, really good at working at home early in the morning until lunch, but I go downstairs for lunch. And when I go downstairs for lunch, then a lot of times it's, it's hard for me to get reengaged. If I'm working at home, typically when I'm working at work, I just eat lunch at my desk and I keep going. So taking that break. It's tough for me to get reengaged, right? So there are times when, if I have gone through kind of a week where every day after lunch, I'm like, man, I can't get reengaged. Then I make myself go somewhere else to work. You know, I go to my office, I go to a coffee shop, I go somewhere where I break that environment because all of us have environments that calls us that, that attract us to bad habits, you know, or set us up for good habits. And so. So manipulating your environment, you know, if you have a bad habit, it's so simple, but if you have a bad habit of staying awake too long at night because you're messing on your phone, then don't take your phone to bed with you. Right? Don't have it laying beside you in bed. It's just, you know, it's, it's simple, but it's really profound when you talk about it. So make it obvious. Or if you're trying to break a habit, make it less obvious.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Yeah.
Track 1:know, if you want to eat more fruit. Put fruit on the counter. If you don't want to eat chips, don't have them in the kitchen or in the house or where they're easily accessible. And it's just that simple. So
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:So to create a good habit, we make it obvious to make to break a bad when we make it invisible is the
Track 1:yeah. Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:second step after making it obvious is you want it to be something that you want to do. So you make it
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:and you make it attractive. Law number two, make it attract attractive.
Track 1:Yeah. You got any, got any wisdom on that one?
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:wisdom on that. I'm making it attractive.
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:I
Track 1:Well, he talks.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:to make it be something that you want to do. And I, you know, it's going to vary from person to person and habit to habit.
Track 1:Yeah. So if you're a very relational person, you're very social. and you love hanging out with people, but you hate exercising, then find a group to exercise with because that will make it more attractive for you, right? To go hang out with people. And I was having a conversation with someone the other day and they were talking about playing golf. And they were talking about how horrible they were at golf and how they really didn't enjoy golf, but they loved the fellowship with the men in their church. And so they were saying, you know, it's well worth it for me to go play golf, to be able to hang out with these guys. So it's like, you want to make something that you do want to do, you know, paired with those things, you know, you need to do right. So again, it comes back to the same thing. This is that habit of. You know, if you're struggling to study the Bible on your own, then get a group of people together that you meet the same time every, you know, day or week or whatever it is, and, and make the environment conducive so that it is, you know so that it's, it's out there in front of you. It's obvious you have a meeting every Tuesday morning at seven o'clock. But then make it attractive because you want to be with these people as well as you want to study the Bible, right? So I think that's where I think that's that's the that's how you may make it attractive He says It's also, he uses this thing called temptation bundling, you know which is basically parent action. You want to do with one you need to do, which is kind of the same thing as habit stacking in a lot of ways. You know
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Right.
Track 1:that reading your Bible while your coffee's brewing, you know, those just kind of things. So
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Right. And, and obviously the opposite, if you want to create a, or extinguish a bad habit is, is you make it unattractive. He didn't have
Track 1:right,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:creative word for you is that,
Track 1:right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:find ways to make that bad habit unattractive,
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:law, this all seems like common sense, but it's just really cool and nice the way he collates and puts it all together. The third law is to make that habit easy. Make it
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:want to, and he uses the term reduce the friction, you know, make it easy for you to slide into this new habit by reducing friction. If there, if you can reduce the number of steps you have to take to, to get to, to starting or beginning or living that habit, then you reduce those steps through preparation.
Track 1:Yeah. You got an example of that.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Well, it's like me laying the Bible close to the coffee pot in advance of the next morning. And I can't say that I've, that I do that or remember to do that every night.
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:but that is one thing that has, has been helpful. I, I don't have to go looking around for. My Bible and, and the reason I, I read specifically from the book instead of from my phone in my hand is because it seems like invariably I, I get distracted, you
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:in or there'll be a news article, I'll just want to go check a news article, you
Track 1:Yep.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:so I leave the phone away and, and, and I, and I use the, the, the printed pages instead as a way to reduce the friction
Track 1:Yes.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:bit easier.
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. And, and I'm trying, some of this is from memory. I read the book. It's been, you know, six months ago, but I, I recall him talking about people who run and how, you know, if someone gets up in the morning and they basically want to run every morning, you know, and they have to drive to a park to run. They get up in the morning, then they have to go through all this. They have to, you know, get ready. They have to find their shoes. They have to find their clothes and figure out if they're clean and, and they get in the car and they got to drive to the park and they got to do this. And I got it. And, and if that's hard for you, a hard habit for you, then you want to reduce as many steps as possible. So. If possible, you don't want to have to drive to the park to run. So you want to run in your neighborhood, you know, you want to make sure the night before your clothes are clean and lay them out and put your shoes beside your bed and do all the, so you're reducing those steps it takes to get from where you are to make the habit happen. And, and it really goes into another part under make it easy, where he talks about using the two minute rule, you know, downsizing all of your habits until they can be done in two minutes or less. And. And basically what he means about that is if your habit is you want to run every morning, then that means you've got to get up every morning. That means you've got to get your shoes on. That means you got, so you want to come back to the, to the very first thing. The very first thing is. Put your running outfit on, right? You're, you're more, you know, and this is all born out of science. You're, you're more apt to actually follow through on running if you put your running clothes on, right? And put your shoes on. And so don't think of the habit as I have to go run a mile. Think of the habit as I need to put my running stuff on. And so you bring it back to that thing. So in your kind of thing, Bill, you know, if we're people who are, we're wanting to, we're wanting to read our Bible more. Then, and we're struggling with that. Then the habit is get up and pick up your Bible, you know, because if you pick up your Bible, you're more than likely to follow through with reading it than if you don't. So, so bring it back to that two minute thing that, that that makes it easier for you to do,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Right.
Track 1:make it easy
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Make
Track 1:and to, and to break a bad habit,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:You make it difficult.
Track 1:make it difficult.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:You know,
Track 1:Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:you know, he cited at one point how many Vietnam veterans, how many of the men that served in Vietnam were coming back addicted to heroin, you know, how many of them they've discovered were addicted to heroin on the field. And, the assumption was that they would not be able. To break that, you know, it was such a, it's such a strong narcotic, but when they got them out of that environment and they weren't in a setting where everybody. There weren't those things that cued up the, the, the, the craving for relief and the ability to experience what heroin did for them. They got him out of that environment and array away from that community of people that were doing that together. It was amazing how. Few of the the soldiers that came home, few of them had difficulty with, you know, staying away from heroin. Once they were out of that setting
Track 1:Yeah, I was, I was
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:upon. There were a whole, and, and, and, and. And, and they, you know, this was a study that really amazed psychologists and those that with substance addiction. They didn't think it could be possible.
Track 1:right, right, right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:a lot to do with, with well, it became much more difficult. They weren't in a setting where it was acceptable. It became much more difficult for them to access and to get. And they didn't need the, the, the relief or whatever that it provided. The cue wasn't there and so they didn't need it as much,
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. I found that in a very interesting study as well, you know, because I think it goes against the grain of what we think about, about addiction, which is a bad habit. Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:right,
Track 1:And the fact is, is that a chain, a complete change of the environment seemed to make a huge difference with these individuals. And so you know, I think as we continue as people of faith to think about the bad habits we have and, and the good habits we need to develop. And we'll talk a little bit more specifically about that when we're done going through these laws, like for our listeners, for people of faith who are in leadership roles what are some of these habits maybe we should be working on? But what's the, after we make it easy, then the last thing is,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:We need to make it satisfying. We need to reinforce, find ways that make it satisfying and reinforce that action. You know, like you have a, you see a, a cupcake on the table. is your cue. You have a craving for something sweet. Your response is I go eat it. And man, it tastes good, you know,
Track 1:Right. Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:it's satisfying. It satisfies that craving. And so we need to think about our good habits in that kind of way. How can we reinforce the choice or the response that is the good one, you know, the response to, to do that exercise or to take the time to read that or to pause and, you know, whatever the good habit is, how do
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:make it and get
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah. And, and he, he uses he uses to give yourself a reward. You know, I think this is on, on the, for those of us of faith, this is where our faith comes in that there should be an inherent reward in having done those things that God wants us to do, you know, and I think there is an inherent reward in that. So I, I, I, I don't disagree with what he's saying there. You know, for instance, you know my wife and I, you know, we, we are, we're on a diet, you know and, and we give ourselves a cheat meal every Sunday afternoon, you know, and it's a reward. It is a reward. If we don't stay on our plan for the six days before. Then, well, let me, let me say this, if we don't stay on our plan for the six days before the thought is to not get the cheat meal. Right. And we do try if we, you know, take an evening and go out with friends or something, we eat something we normally wouldn't eat. We do try then to skip, make that kind of our cheat meal for the week. But the fact is, is it is incredibly rewarding to know, Hey, we've done six days of eating healthy.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:yeah.
Track 1:And today we're going to eat something, you know, we want to eat not, not way out of base, but something that we typically wouldn't eat. And, and it becomes something that you really look forward to all week. You know, like we jokingly like on Monday are saying, where are we going to have Sunday evening for our, you know, our meal? And So I think there is something to rewarding yourself for doing things. But then as people of faith, there is this inherent reward of I've done what God has called me to do and what God wants me to do. And so, so yeah, it's pretty, pretty awesome. So what are they again, if I'm going to develop a good habit, I'm going to do what,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:You're going to make it obvious. You're going to make it attractive. You're going to make it easy and you're going to make it satisfying.
Track 1:and if I want to break it,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:one, you make that habit invisible. You make it unattractive, you make it difficult and you make it unsatisfying.
Track 1:yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:So
Track 1:very, very good. Very good. So for the person of faith bill, especially the person who is a leader, what are some habits that biblically and in leadership, what are some habits that we could apply? Maybe this this methodology to to help us do a little bit better. You think of anything or any in your own life that,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Well, we have been we're challenging our, our church family, our, our people to commit or to strive to live with, with four habits consistently. habit of worship, which is. The habit of gathering as a people, but then also seeing your life as an act of worship and worshiping on a personal level throughout the week when you're not as a gathered people through reading God's word and through prayer. And then seeing what you do vocationally as an act of worship to the Lord. So we wanted to challenge people to make the habit of worship part of their life. We challenge people to connect to friends in the body of Christ where you grow in love for God together, but also grow in love for one another. And it's those relationships that are cultivated that will help us. Foster. You know, that makes us part of that community that he talks about in the book that helps us foster those good habits that we want to grow in our lives. And I think
Track 1:Okay.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:of the faith empowered workplace leader. We need, we need to make worship a habit. We need to make connecting to friends who are, are part of the body of Christ who can help us grow in love for God, one another. We need to find our third habit is, is serving. find ways to use what we've been given to, to help and be a blessing to others. We do it for God's glory, for their good. And, and, and it's good for us as well. But then
Track 1:Okay.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:habit I think we as believers have a duty to do is In whatever things we are doing, whether it's worship, it's work, connecting with friends or serving others, we are to share Jesus, you know, and make that a habit of what, our life. And if, if those kind of what we're trying to foster and encourage here at, at, in our churches, if we can get people who are living those four habits they will be. Amen. Fulfilling the great commandment of loving God and loving people. And if we're loving God and loving people, then we're going to fulfill the great commission by making disciples. And so that's
Track 1:Right.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:and I think that that has crossover into whatever profession you, you live in as a follower of Christ. Those, those are some habits that I think that. That we need to encourage and we need to foster and, and find ways to make those things obvious, attractive, easy and satisfying.
Track 1:Yeah. Yeah.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:so
Track 1:Yeah. I, I think those are great. And I think any leader really what they just need to do is they just need to go back and And figure out what they're trying to accomplish and then pray and discern what daily habits, you know, if you want to write a good article for your church newsletter, then Habitually right every day for 10 minutes, you know, or research every day for 10 minutes. So you're not, you know, finding yourself at the last minute trying to figure out what to do. If you're a pastor and you're developing sermons every week, then get into the habit of what do you need to do daily to have a good sermon on Sunday morning? You know and that's where I think this model really makes sense. If my goal is to have my sermon done by Friday so that I have a good sermon on Sunday, you know, what makes that happen? What makes that happen is what you do on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. Right. And so focus on the systems, focus on the habit. There are some resources out there, you know, Covey, That book, Stephen Covey, the seven habits of highly effective people, you know that's a good resource to look at as some kind of habits that are good for leaders, I think, but, but overall really comes down to you uniquely. What are those things that God wants you to accomplish back up from that? What does God need me to do today and every day? So that I accomplish those things he wants me to accomplish. So,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:yeah,
Track 1:good stuff, bill. And we've been trying to, you know, shorten things down a little bit. So we're a little bit shorter today, so
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Yep.
Track 1:we can go ahead and land the plane. So anything else?
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:Um, no, I, I would strongly encourage the book even though it's not, it's not it's entirely secular. It's, it's really
Track 1:Yeah,
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:and I think
Track 1:yeah, it is. It is.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:encouraging to me and I struggle with, with having good habits. I really do. And so this is, it's real worth the read.
Track 1:Yep. I totally agree. Atomic Habits by James Clear. Thank you all for listening. We appreciate all of you who tune into the podcast on YouTube or listen on all your favorite podcast channels. If you want to reach out to us, we invite you to become part of our Facebook group, The Few. And if you ever want, have any ideas for us on things you would like to hear us talk about, feel Feel free to put it in that group or email us at edit renew ts. com or bill at renew ts. com. But until next time, we hope that you are.
dr--bill-brown_1_04-06-2023_093012:One of the